How is legal residence determined?

My dad actually physically lives in New York City. BUT: _every_ "address" for him is to my place, in Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here, all his bills and such are sent here, all of his mail comes here, his assets are registered at my address]. Is he still considered a resident of NYS? [first, for legal matters, and second for taxes: would he still have to pay NYS/NYC taxes? VA taxes? (heavenforfend, both..:o)) Where would he vote? in NYS or absentee ballot in VA?]

/Bernie\

Reply to
Bernie Cosell
Loading thread data ...

First there is domicile, which you acquire at birth and keep until you establish a new one (one and only one domicile at a time).

Then there is residence, for tax purposes each state has its own rules.

As Katie (one of the resident experts, pun intended) has pointed out in the past, it is possible to be a domiciliary resident of one jurisdiction and a statutory resident of another, subject to resident taxation of both -- although often there will be some kind of credit for taxes paid to the other state, to reduce or eliminate double taxation.

If you dad maintains stronger ties overall to VA but lives and works in NY, its sounds like he is indeed a taxable resident of both NY and VA.

(cross-posting to m.l.m. removed from this reply).

-Mark Bole

Reply to
Mark Bole

Ummm, your domicile IS (ostensibly) where you "physically" live. So NYC is where your dad lives. If he wants to send all his mail somewhere else, he is free to do so... but that doesn't make him a resident of Virginia any more than renting a PO Box in NYC would make him a resident of the post office.

Reply to
Timothy
Reply to
ChenangoBusinessServices

New York State has a document on-line that addresses the issue of domicile. It is geared towards people who establish a home in Florida to try to get out of NY taxes. It has a series of guidelines to help an auditor determine what is fair. A key question is how much time does your dad spend in NY as compared to VA? I think he loses right there, he is a NY resident. The next one is where does he keep his "near and dear items" such as personal photos and family heirlooms. Another one is where does he visit the dentist or go for routine medical checks. Banking used to be a factor, but with electronic banking in past years and Internet today, you can open a bank account just about anywhere.

-john-

Reply to
John A. Weeks III

Does he have earned income or is he retired? That doesn't matter - just interested in more detail,

Depending on where you live and where you work, you either pay your taxes where you live or where you work or sometimes both. NYC is one of those places where you may have to pay in both places.

Without more information, it appears to me that he has to pay NYC and NYS taxes, but not VA taxes since he has no nexus in VA other than a son doing his recordkeeping.

Run the numbers to see how much less he'd pay if he moved to VA.

Also he should be voting in NYC.

Dick

Reply to
Dick Adams

Except that you are correct to note, as you do at least implicitly, that "resident" and "residence" are accorded different law significant meanings depending on the particular context/purposes in/for which those words are used, even if you did not say (though you did) that your father "actually" [sic] resides in New York City, surrounding the word "address" to which you refer in Va. where you reside ("[your] address") with quotation marks appears to suggest (at least unless/until you fact-specifically describe otherwise) that your father neither resides in Va. nor treats Va. as his "domicile" (for any N.Y. law purposes) because you do not say, with respect to the latter issue, that he intended at any time in the past or presently intends to treat Va. as his permanent residence.

To the contrary, the most you so far appear to say in this connection is that he has been using "[your] address" as a mail drop -- no less, but also (for, "Where does he 'reside' and where is he 'domiciled'?" purposes) no more.

Apart from you not having said that your father during whatever (also not actually here identified) period you have in mind has resided or has been or plans ever to be domiciled in Va. or has conducted any business in/by/through which he generated any income in Va., so that one cannot answer reliably solely on the basis of the facts you so far state whether he would/wouldn't have any income tax liability to Va., if you mean by "actually physically lives in New York City" that your father has maintained a permanent apartment or other abode there at which he has spent an aggregate of more than one-hundred eighty-three days during each to you relevant year in New York state and city, then he is a "resident individual" for the purposes of being obliged to report and, if relevant/applicable, o pay New York State and New York City income taxes (re. which, see/read N.Y. Tax Law § 605(b) and N.Y.C. Administrative Code § 11-1705[b] [which mirrors the said state tax law provision]).

For background discussion/analysis for New York income tax purposes (including a discussion of "double taxation" issues if they are relevant to you), perhaps the presently most dispositive case law source worth reading (there are hundreds of reported and unreported decisions dealing with state straddling individuals raising these issues) is In re Tamagni, 91 N.Y.2d 530, 673 N.Y.S.2d 44, 695 N.E.2d

1125 (1998) which is also discussed/glossed in later such cases.
Reply to
nospam

Reply to
Benjamin Yazersky CPA

I have a nearly identical, but opposite, situation. Someone who moved from NY State to VA in 2006 and lived in VA through all of 2007. She still has a NY driver's license and NY plates on the car; her mailing address is her son's address in NY. Her bank accounts are in NY and she still travels to NY for doctor visits. Presumably, she votes absentee in NY. In VA she lives with a family member; much of her furniture and personal possessions are in storage in NY.

She does not work in VA and did not work in NY. Her income in 2007 is limited to payments under a separation agreement with her soon-to-be ex-husband plus part of his pension. She also earns a small income through some tutoring at a local elementary school in VA. She owns a rental condo in NY which will likely break even or produce a loss in

2007. She has no residence or job to return to in NY, although she claims that "someday" she may return to that state.

She wants to file as a NY resident - using the son's address - and not file at all in VA, since NY does not tax pension income, but VA does. I maintain she must file as a Resident of VA, having lived there an entire year and may need to also file a Non-Resident return in NY should the NY condo show a taxable profit.

Is that accurate? From this thread, I learn that she may qualify as a Resident of both NY and VA? Is filing solely as a NY Resident - and not filing in VA - a possible scenario?

Reply to
R. Pile

The OP not having said that his father stays for any residential purpose with the OP at the OP's Va. residence and/but having said that his father "actually" [sic] "lives" [sic] in New York City" [sic] and also not having said that his father resides or is domiciled at any other location, why isn't that enough information to conclude that his father is a N.Y. resident?

Reply to
nospam

[...]

True, but you can still only visit a physical ATM and walk into a physical bank lobby with physical tellers at a specific physical location, and those transactions are recorded (physically...).

-Mark Bole

Reply to
Mark Bole

} My dad actually physically lives in New York City. BUT: _every_ "address" } for him is to my place, in Virginia. [e.g., his bank accounts are here, } all his bills and such are sent here, all of his mail comes here, his assets are } registered at my address]. Is he still considered a resident of NYS?

I see that this is a complicated area and it is time for me to check with both VA and NY lawyers. Probably a key determinant, which i didn't want to mention up front [which is why I had quotes around some of the words in the OP] is that my dad is in a nursing home, and what i guess I was really wondering is whether the nursing home is now his 'legal residence' or if his residence is with me. [as someone mentioned, I am, in fact, doing all of his recordkeeping, paying his bills, his assets, such as they are, are registered at my address, I have a PoA for him, etc]. From the comments it appears that, indeed, the nursing home is his "residence" now [which is fine, just means, for example, I'll be dealing with four tax setups instead of just two [most of you know that in addition to New York State taxes, there is also a New York _City_ income tax!], but time to get a more solid legal opinion....

/Bernie\

Reply to
Bernie Cosell

But that wouldn't show where you lived. I could live in Florida and yet fly to NY every morning on business, got to an ATM or a bank and get cash for the strippers (er, I mean the entertainment hostesses at the business meeting) and then fly back each evening and never sleep in NY at all.

Reply to
Mike

Thu, 21 Feb 2008 07:42:39 -0500 from Bernie Cosell :

My sympathies for your position. It must be difficult to have a beloved parent in care several hundred miles away from you.

Legally, though, I don't see that this is so complicated. Where did he live before he went into the home? If it was New York, then he has no residential connection with Virginia. If it was Virginia, I'd still bet dollars to donuts that his legal residence is New York because that's where he sleeps each night.

You know, I imagine, that you can get forms on line at

formatting link
. I don't believe you have to file a separate form for NYC tax -- as far as I can recall there are extra lines on the state form for city residents. But of course that's something you'll want to check on your own.

I don't understand. He has no earned or unearned income in Virginia and he doesn't live there. Why would Virginia taxes enter into it?

Reply to
Stan Brown

It's only a couple of lines on the New York State tax form (and some more money, of course).

Seth

Reply to
Seth

BeanSmart website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.