Somebody yesterday wanted to buy my product. I had to say to him: "The place you wish to install it, was it constructed after 31 Dec 1972 or before? If the former I can sell it to you but it will be illegal for you to use it. If the latter you can use it legally but I can't sell it to you because that would be illegal!" What am I selling?

Anything using pre decimal currency eg a coin handling machine (I forget the exact transition date) ? Assuming the customer was in the UK. Daytona

Trivia: What do I sell?

Nov 25, 2004 27 Replies

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Ronald Raygun 21 years ago

Well, it's true that "dubious" and "doubtful" can be synonymous. It's even true that they can be synonymous and hence interchangeable both when expressing the notion (when applied in relation to a person) that that person is to be doubted, and when expressing the notion that that person is the one doing the doubting.

But interchangeability breeds ambiguity, and best practice is to avoid it, and so it is good to favour one word for one context, and the other for the other. I believe common usage does prefer "doubtful" for the situation more accurately described as questioning (because it aligns well with "full of doubt"), and "dubious" for the other, more accurately described as questionable.

"Dubious" sounds more sexy than "doubtful", but I refer you to the entry "working and stylish words" in Fowler's, which, though not specifically contrasting "dubious" and "doubtful", does mention "dubiety" and "doubt".

Sexy is bad.

I shouldn't need to tell an a.u.e stalwart this. :-)

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Troy Steadman 21 years ago

Well Mr Raygun, that being the case I am surprised you chose "doubtful" at all. The phrase "I doubt that..." has volte-faced 180 degrees since Shakespeare's time, previously meaning "I think it probably is...", currently meaning "I think it probably isn't..."

I believe if you had studied Fowler more closely and followed it up with Eric Partridge's "Usage and Abusage" you would have avoided climbing on to this linguistic merry-go-round in the first place.

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Matti Lamprhey 21 years ago

And I believe it's still used the original way by some Scotch folk, who should no better.

You haven't responded to my challenge about the formulation of this puzzle, I notice!

Matti

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Ronald Raygun 21 years ago

You are? Then you must have missed the point.

Spot the verbed noun. Very sexy.

Needless redundant unnecessary repetition is not required.

Perhaps that's why Fowler deprecates "doubt that" and prefers "doubt whether".

Thanks for the tip. That really needs to go on my "Dear Santa" list.

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Troy Steadman 21 years ago

If you can tell me in non-gobbledygook what the challenge consists of I will rise to it.

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Troy Steadman 21 years ago

Two weeks ago I didn't understand pleonasm, now you can no longer catch me with that next time.

Famous book from the forties. C T Onions, the other Fowler's The Kings English, due to my wife's [subjunctive] or wife deciding my library should go "Lite" a few years ago I no longer have any of them, I wonder if they are available on-line?

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Matti Lamprhey 21 years ago

Your puzzle said that you couldn't sell the goods (a black-and-white numberplate) to someone who was going to use it on a pre-1973 vehicle. This does not seem to be the case. I'm wondering whether I've misunderstood the puzzle, or whether you think it really IS illegal to make such a sale.

Matti

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usenet 21 years ago

... er but I can fit it on a car having bought it across the counter somewhere. It only requires a screwdriver usually.

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