Filed a 1099 misc to a business, formatted EIN as an SSN

Where did you find the big list of EINs to match?

The IRS has a TIN matching service.

I've used it because I have an EIN for a sole proprietorship and people kept kicking back my 1099s because the match failed. I still don't understand when I'm supposed to use the EIN vs my SSN.

As a bonus confusion, I also have a single member LLC with its own EIN because it used to be a two-member LLC, but they seem OK with that.

I wouldn't worry about it.

Thanks. I was trying to search for that on the IRS Web site the other day but didn't spot it.

Thank you for your reply! That makes me feel a bit better

The rules as you know them are probably correct. Technically you should use your SS# for W-2 employment, and your EIN for everything else (though the IRS prefers you not use an EIN as a sole proprietor, they accept that it's permissible). I do the same thing - use an EIN for my sole proprietorship. But I haven't had any problems with it - at least not that anyone has told me about.

Technically when you go from being taxed as a partnership to a proprietorship, you should use your SS# or get a new EIN. Do you still file Form 1065?

According to Stuart O. Bronstein snipped-for-privacy@lexregia.com:

The TIN match recognized my name but not the name of my business which is a pain. It looks like I can write to the IRS and tell them the business name that goes with the EIN. Has anyone done that?

No more 1065s, it's now a disregarded entity. I looked and found advice on the IRS web site that says that since it's the same LLC, it keeps the same EIN. It switched from partnership to disregarded a decade ago and the IRS hasn't objected.

"John Levine" snipped-for-privacy@taugh.com wrote in news:up4hvn$2k77$ snipped-for-privacy@gal.iecc.com:

This is the page that I found saying the opposite. But if they haven't given you any problem, there's no reason to change it now:

According to Stuart O. Bronstein snipped-for-privacy@lexregia.com:

When I look at at that page, there are lists of when you will have to get a new EIN and when you won't have to get a new EIN. While turning a single-member LLC into a partnership is in the new EIN list, the converse isn't.

Poking around on the intertubes, this page says keep the same EIN:

This page says you need a new EIN, but it links to the same page you found that doesn't say that:

I've read through all this and I don't agree with Mr. Bronstein. Mr. Levine's LLC was taxed as a multi-member partnership. The other partners left so it's a single-member LLC, owned by Mr. Levine and now a disregarded entity treated as a sole proprietor. If there were no EIN previously and there was no payroll, then an EIN wouldn't even be required. As he's long had an EIN, he might as well continue to use it.

Why is he getting informed of no match? My guess is that it's the same thing as we've discussed elsewhere in this thread, that the 9-digit number is not being matched to EINs but SSNs.

If Mr. Levine still retained his EIN assignment letter from decades ago, then he should provide a copy of it to any payor required to report a payment on a 1099 so they are given the clue that it's an EIN and not an SSN. If not, give the payor a W-9, which has separate fields for the number, whether it's an SSN or EIN.

If their information return preparation software still will not accept his EIN as the TIN to use for reporting, then they'll have to issue his

1099 on paper.

He can cooperate, but truly, that the payor is using software that just doesn't meet his needs is not Mr. Levine's problem.

No. There is no new entity. It's still organized and operated as the same LLC. Even though the nature of the LLC changed -- one member remains after the other members withdrew, IRS does not see a new sole proprietor. Because the number of its members changed, the existing entity has a new classification for tax purposes, formerly a partnership, now a disregarded entity to be treated as a sole proprietor.

"Adam H. Kerman" snipped-for-privacy@chinet.com wrote in news:up77a7$ahvm$ snipped-for-privacy@dont-email.me:

You misunderstand how the IRS treats LLCs. As fas as the IRS is concerned (except when it comes to employment taxes) they don't exist. When an LLC gets an EIN, it's really not the LLC that gets it, but the partnership or the proprietor who gets it, not really the LLC - because they don't exist for IRS purposes.

"Treats", yes, as in classification for tax treatment. The LLC, organized under state law, is still a business entity for federal tax law.

I just read through the instructions for the SS-4. Lines 8a-8c are used to provide information about the LLC, which is then described in 9a. The instructions note specifically that Line 9a is not an election for tax classification. If the default classification is accepted, then Form

8832 isn't filed. The form's instructions don't discuss whether IRS regards the LLC now changed to single member as a new entity.

The closest the instructions come to your position is Line 10. Reason for applying. There is a choice "Changed type of organization" such as becoming a partnership, but it's significant that there is no discussion of LLCs here.

However, Form 8832 is filed to change the classification. I also read through the instructions. Changing to a single-member LLC and accepting default classification as a disregarded entity isn't precisely an election but this appears to be the easiest way to notify IRS.

Nothing in Form 8832's instructions say not to use this form for this purpose, or to file a new SS-4 to obtain a new EIN instead.

Similar to your position, LLCs are discussed in Publication 1635 Understanding Your EIN, but there is no discussion about whether changing from multi member to single member is treated as a new entity. There is a comment that the individual with multiple sole proprietor businesses may use one EIN for any or all of them. In the partnership discussion, there is discussion that there is a new entity if one partner takes over and operates it as a sole proprietorship. There is no discussion here about changing from a multi member to single member LLC.

Given the absense of clear instructions specific to whether IRS regards the change from multi member to single member LLC as a new entity, I'm going to assume it does not.

As long as the entity has informed IRS on Form 8832 of the change to single member and that it's classification is now disregarded entity, I don't see why IRS would consider it to be a new entity. It's reporting multi member or single member LLC on the 8832 and the classification election that's controlling, not the EIN itself.

If it weren't, and the classification change required the issuance of a new EIN, then there'd be no need for the 8832. The election could be made directly on the SS-4.

In my other followup, pending approval, I believe I'm wrong. Form 8832 is not required because, with the change from multi member to single member, the LLC is not making an election that's different from the default classification. 8832 is required only if the LLC elected to be treated like a corporation in leiu of partnership or disregarded, or elected to end treatment as a corporation.

I read the regulations.

T.R. 301.7701-3(f)(2)

26 CFR Sec 301.7701-3 - Classification of certain business entities.

(f) Changes in number of members of an entity

(2) Partnerships and single member entities. An eligible entity classified as a partnership becomes disregarded as an entity separate from its owner when the entity's membership is reduced to one member. A single member entity disregarded as an entity separate from its owner is classified as a partnership when the entity has more than one member. If an elective classification change under paragraph (c) of this section is effective at the same time as a membership change described in this paragraph (f)(2), the deemed transactions in paragraph (g) of this section resulting from the elective change preempt the transactions that would result from the change in membership.

The entire paragraph refers to the classification of the entity from partnership to disregarded upon becoming a single member entity. From single member to multi member, it was classified as disregarded and becomes classified as a partnership.

The classification changes. The change from single member to multi member, or the reverse, does not make it a new entity.

All partnerships have to have EINs. And like he said, as far as the IRS is concerned, LLCs do not exist. I think there used to be a special case for a partnership that is an LLC turning into a proprietorship that is an LLC, and I'm grandfathered.

You're confusing two threads. The EIN for the LLC is fine.

I have a separate older sole proprietorship with a different EIN. For that EIN, the TIN matches on my name but not the name of the business, which is a pain in the neck.

Now that I look at a blank W-9, it looks like I need to put my name on line 1 and the business name on line 2 and that might make them happy with the EIN.

I pointed out very similar language supporting your position, quoted above, in the instructions for completing the SS-4 Application for EIN Line 10. Nevertheless, that the classification change of an LLC is not explicitly stated as a reason for IRS to treat the same LLC as a new entity should lead to the logical conclusion that if IRS were treating it as a new entity, it would have so stated.

The classification of an entity can be changed without IRS treating said change as subsequent treatment as a new entity, hence the 8832. There are no instructions on the 8832 that a classification change, whether default tax treatment or elective tax treatment, also requires treating it as a new entity after classification change.

This is a classification change, not IRS treating the old entity as a new entity after the classification change. These are two different concepts in tax law.

But that's classification.

Let's say an elective classification is made, say, taxing a multi member LLC as a corporation (and then making the separate election to be an S corp) and not as a partnership. This election can be revoked subsequently if enough time has passed. IRS isn't recognizing that there is a new entity with each election or revoking of election.

I'm sorry but in the absense of explicit instructions with regard to LLCs, which are not found in the regulations either (quoted in my other followup), I don't believe there is support for your position that change in classification of an LLC means that IRS is treating it as a brand new entity.

Sorry about that.