TheAA advertises 5.8% loans - SCAM or what?

Fairly long intro here - specific questions at the bottom.

Browsing the MotleyFool pages I saw that TheAA were offering loans with 5.8% interest (typical) which can't be bad. (Note the use of "typical").

I went through the on-line application process - all went well until the final page when I was told that there was a minor query on my application and asked to phone them.

This I did.

I was then told that they couldn't loan me the amount asked for at

5.8% BUT they'd be very happy to loan it at 6.8%!!

When I queried this I was told that the 5.8% was "typical" - and indeed the small print does say "You may be offered a different rate depending on your personal circumstances, our credit assessment procedure and other related factors." She did not think the 5.8% was an advertising scam to get the potential borrowers' attention.

When I queried why I had been rejected for the 5.8% I was then told it was due to my Credit Score.

I then asked if they could put this in writing to me - I was told that they couldn't as that would be against the Data Protection Act. (Yes, I know - this isn't the case - I also asked for the details of their Data Controller - I was told they do not have one. Please don't divert thread to discussions of this and Data Protection - happy to give more details/discuss on new thread ).

I was told if I was not happy I would have to phone in office hours and speak to a supervisor.

I have since done this - the supervisor explained that they could not offer me a loan at 5.8% as my credit score was not high enough - when pushed she said they would be concerned about me having difficulty in repaying or defaulting as indicated by my credit score. However, they were more than happy to loan me at the higher rate. I explained that this would of course mean I would have to pay back more each month. In TheAA's view this means that you are less of a credit risk - if you can't find x pounds a month you can obviously find more than x pounds more easily!!

I told her I had recently applied for two new credit cards - both of which had been issued - I was not a credit risk in the eyes of the banks. She then told me that the checks carried out for my credit card applications would make my score lower.

I have seen both my credit reports and there is nothing iffy on either, I suspect that I am quite a good or even very good credit risk

- never had any trouble with credit cards, CCJs, banks, 0% interest etc etc.

I have recently applied for two new credit cards - again no problem - both issued OK.

Questions:

1) Under what circumstances could a "poor" (in their eyes) credit score mean it is OK to make a loan at a higher rate?

2) Is the information which the credit reference agencies supply to an individual the same as they supply to companies doing credit checks - or is there more to the companies?

3) Am I right in saying that the credit reference agencies do NOT provide a credit score against an individual.

4) Do the credit reference agencies tell companies how many credit checks have been made against an individual in the recent past?

5) Does having multiple checks made with credit reference agencies in itself cause a deterioration in any credit scoring - if so how?
Reply to
Peter Ramm
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They expect a higher proportion of defaulters among those with a poor score. So the charges are higher in order to recoup these additional losses.

Reply to
Alec McKenzie

Yes, that's how it works. The higher the risk of you defaulting, the higher the rate they'll offer you.

It's exactly the same if you lend money to companies (ie corporate bonds), the higher the risk of the company going bust, the higher the interest rate they have to pay.

It's a gamble, and like with any gamble, for higher risks, higher rewards are expected. If I backed an outsider in the 3:30 at Kempton Park I'd expect a bigger payout than if I backed the favourite.

As to why they think you're too poor a credit risk to get the 5.8% rate, it may be because of your salary level, or if you don't have a permanent job (contractor etc), if you aren't a homeowner, not married etc. It may have nothing to do with your credit history.

Reply to
Andy Pandy

Hmm..Interesting

Did you take out the "optional" payment protection insurance?

I recently applied for a loan with my bank (Abbey National) over a 12 month period, but specified I did not want the payment insurance. I have been with the bank almost 16 years, have had 2 pervious loans and have never been overdrawn. I have no CCJs and my Equifax credit rating is Excellent. I have been continuously employed for the last 16 years - with the same company.

I applied for a loan at a 5.8% typical rate and was stunned to receive a letter along with the loan agreement papers, saying they were delighted to offer me a loan at 12% APR! I phoned up and queried and was told by a rather snooty droid that the APR rating was based on credit scoring. He then transferred me to the sales line and I hung after 10 minutes on hold.

2 weeks on, I receive a follow up letter to the effect that they had not received my signed loan agreement. I was sorely tempted to ring up and give them a piece of my mind but I refrained as bad language can sometimes cause offence :)

I think the ridiculous APR offered was due to the fact that I declined the "optional" payment protection insurance (rip-off) and that possibly their credit scoring formula is flawed. I will take my business elsewhere and sent their customer services dept a letter telling them I've gone with a competitor and advising them where to stick their loan agreement.

Perhaps they don't like applicants with the name "Peter" ? :)

Reply to
Trust No One

You could have hit the nail on the head here - no I didn't!!

Reply to
Peter Ramm

"Peter Ramm" wrote

It's not objectively "poor"; it's relative.

There's less supplied to companies. They see what you owe, but not who to.

Yes

Yes. It makes you look desperate for credit, and implies that you are being rejected by other lenders. The only way to get a loan is to prove you don't need a loan.

Reply to
John Redman

"John Redman" wrote

Not in one respect :- If you have any financial associations, then when *you* look at your file, you don't see the financial associate's accounts. When a company looks at your file, they *do*!

Reply to
Tim

Ther's your problem. You have just got 2 new sources of getting yourself into debt. They will be looking at your ability to loan money via your credit cards and your ability to pay it off should you avail yourself of that credit, and that will lower your score.

Why do you need 2 new credit cards for anyway are your others max'd out??

Reply to
AK

I had a disagreement with NatWest after 15 years using theirs cards so cut up both MasterCard and Visa - then first went with an MBNA card but have since moved to Tesco's - all in space of 2-3 months. I can't really believe this makes me a bad credit risk - particularly when I'd had my NatWest for about 15 year and never defaulted on a payment.

Reply to
Peter Ramm

I took the question as meaning 'do I see less than a company would when looking at my file'.

Reply to
John Redman

"John Redman" wrote

So did I - when a company looks at your file, they will see more (if you have any financial associates). Therefore, *you* see *less* than the company would!

While talking about this, I find it highly suspect that a company has the legal right to see data from Person2, when only Person1 agrees to them seeing their (Person1's) credit file - in other words, Person2 has not given their permission for their file to be looked at, only Person1 has (the one applying for the credit).

Another court case in waiting??

Reply to
Tim

All they know is that you have recently got a lot of credit, that's all the credit referrence agency will tell them nothing about your time at NatWest...............lets face it if you have 2 cards with 5k credit each on them and then you ask for a 10k car loan, and you may have a mortgage, they will be looking at your income, they will assume you will use the cards to the max and they will look to see if you can afford it.

Reply to
AK

Typical rate is the rate that they must give to 66% of their customers. You obviously do not fit into that percentage.

Payment protection will have no bearing on it.

What could have made a difference is that you took 2 new credit cards out, and then are asking for more money, (possibly have other cards as well) means the total exposure to credit could be high. How long you have been at your address/work/home owner status, and even how much you want can make a big difference.

Reply to
Phil Deane

At 14:35:57 on 04/03/2005, Peter Ramm delighted uk.finance by announcing:

Higher risk = higher charges

They will use the information from a CRA to determine your credit score. This is why they cannot give it to you. They cannot do so under the DPA since they do not actually hold that information. They could give you your score itself but are highly unlikely to do so, and it would mean absolutely nothing to you in any case.

No, you're not.

That depends on the lender you approach. They may, for instance, assume you have actually taken out credit with those companies. The results of any applciations are not provided to viewers of your file.

Reply to
Alex

At 17:51:31 on 04/03/2005, Peter Ramm delighted uk.finance by announcing:

This is irrelevant. It is illegal for companies to base their rate on whether or not you take out their PPI.

Reply to
Alex

At 21:45:23 on 04/03/2005, John Redman delighted uk.finance by announcing:

Er, no.

Nonsense.

Reply to
Alex

"Tim" wrote

Source for this? AFAIK, your file is your file and what you see is exactly what an inquirer sees, except that inquirers do not get to know with whom you have credit. Thus, they see less. If you have been associated with any other individuals that will be stated in the version of the report that you see.

Reply to
John Redman

"Alex" wrote

I believe that's incorrect. CRAs provide raw data on which individual lenders base their own credit scoring. Nobody has a generic 'credit score' as such.

Reply to
John Redman

"Alex" wrote

You wish.

Reply to
John Redman

It is not irrelevant. It may be illegal - that does not mean that companies do not do it. It would be very difficult to prove. I can see no logical reason why they should offer me a loan at 6.8% but not at 5.8% and I await an explanation. The fact that I did not take their PPI *may* be the reason.

Reply to
Peter Ramm

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