Unique Taxpayer Reference

Self Assessment Helpline

Surely if you didn't work in the last tax year (to April 06) then you have nothing to declare for the 31st of this month. Your tax return for income from Oct 06 onwards isn't due until after April 07. Or am I missing something?

-Neil F.

True. His return (and tax cheque) would not be due until the end of January 08. During April 07, though, enough info ought to be at his fingertips to allow him to get his return out.

It surprises me that someone with no UTR or NI number yet, but who registers as self-employed with the NI people (for the purpose of making sure his Class 2 NICs are paid) would not autmatically be allocated a UTR.

Thanks Niel F I understand better now after reading the directgov website.

You're not missing anything. I only took in part of the message!

It shouldn't surprise you. UTRs are generally only issued if and when you notify a need to submit SATR. And presumably the OP got his NINO when he was about 16. (He doesn't say he hasn't got one.)

There's no such thing as automatically relating to HMRC. The whole place is in chaos and badly managed.

Yes, I have a NI number and card which I got when I was 16, I included that on the self employment form. I never recieved a UTR, and even though there was a box on the form for it, I left it blank, thinking they'll issue me one. Thinking about it now, I should really have phoned them and asked. However I was in a rush as I didn't want to get fined the £100 for not registering self employment within 3 months.

If he already has a NINO, he doesn't need a UTR. The NINO is unique enough. Actually, I don't know whether a UTR is required for filing online (and he seems to be keen on this for some inexplicable reason). I've only once attempted it and that was a disaster, so I won't bother until (if ever) it becomes compulsory (which will never happen) or I'm offered a HUGE bribe. Paper is *much* more user friendly.

If you haven't got a UTR they should issue one to you upon receipt of the form.

Yes, I have a NI number and card which I got when I was 16, I included that on the self employment form. I never recieved a UTR, and even though there was a box on the form for it, I left it blank, thinking they'll issue me one.

### You did right. The form you sent will result in you getting a UTR.

Thinking about it now, I should really have phoned them and asked.

### That wouldn't have worked.

Just give it time - you'll get something in a few weeks.

Yes it is. They won't allow you to submit a SATR unles you "need" to - and "needing to" generates a UTR.

"HUGE" - as in "not being jailed for non-compliance"... :-)

Tosh. But amusing tosh....

It may be if you do your own tax return in April and that's the end of it.

It's different when you've got 50 clients still not having sent their information at the beginning of January and you are fielding phone calls from new clients every day!

CORRECTION - few months - if you phone HMRC and tell them what they need to do!

You know, plumbers charge more for emergency call-outs and rush-jobs than for ordinary planned work. Why don't you encourage your clients to get their data to you sooner by charging double for all work carried out in January?

Of course you could dress this up by doubling your normal hourly rate across the board, and offering 50% discounts in the non-rush months.

After the last few years I thought I'd avoid it by chasing people in April, May & June.

Despite my efforts people still come to me late so I am thinking I will have to do something like you suggest next year.