Quicken 2008 Release 5

John's tantrums usually run 3-4 exchanges, the latter part is name calling, profanity and self justification. Nothing new, happens many times....probably in the moodily silent mode right now trying to come out of
it.

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Ah, that helps clear it up a bit. I only look into the newsgroups from time to time, and participate infrequently, so I'm not up on the nuances of personalities. I vaguely recall an exchange with him some number of months/years ago...don't remember the details, but I recall some rigidity in viewpoints. John has a lot to offer on a variety of Quicken related topics.

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Steve Larson wrote:

Steve; you are the exact person that I identified in my first comment in this most recent discussion.
Every single time you post, you prove my point.
I knew exactly who you were before you posted, what you believe to be your "defense", in this discussion. And I knew exactly what you were going to say in your "defense".
[Please note the ignorance of your defender; a moron who thinks that if morons- like you and he - can't get a rise every time they post a stupid comment, that they have discovered something important.]
When you post your trash here, you can count on having it refuted. [So you can stop you ignorant pretense that someone is trying to interfere with your right to self expression. It's not your right to self expression that you're afraid is being restricted ... it's your ignorance that your afraid is being exposed.]
Despite your denials; you are an ignorant, self-serving bigot.
--
John Pollard
First initial underscore Last name at mchsi dot com
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M eebers wrote:

What intelligent comment have you ever made.
I say what needs to be said, then I let jerks like you and steve prove that I am right.
You have done so once again.
--
John Pollard
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You are one funny guy John. You resort to calling people "jerks" because you're the possom backed into a corner and can do no better but rear the ugly sharp fangs. Stick to the Quicken topics, oh dear Johnny, all else that comes from you is laughable musings of a very frustrated soul. It's a shame no one else can have any knowledge on any subjects that disagree with your vast array of brilliance, which amounts to all topics known to mankind. I could only hope to achieve a fraction of your omnicience in my lifetime. I mean, I am just humbled that your knowledge approaches that of God's omniscience. In fact, He's probably a bit intimidated, and humbled, by your intellictual abilities as well. Have you had a talk with Him yet about the things He did "wrong" in your world?

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You don't want to subsidize the "American workforce". Will you stand up in protest of subsidizing the "American corporation" with tax breaks then? If, as conservatives argue, a corporation has the rights of a person, then shouldn't we stop giving welfare to corporation-persons as well? If this kind of corporate welfare is accepted, and corporations have been granted the legal protections of personhood by the Republicans, then we should afford the same welfare handouts to American citizens. Why is it better to guarantee executive bonuses than to ensure good paying American jobs. Once we stop 100% of all tax breaks and welfare to American corporations, then I'll go along with your whack-a-doodle view of unrestricted globalization. At that point, it will be an even playing field.

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Steve Larson wrote:

I am opposed to special tax favors for anyone.
Why would you assume there is some dichotomy between not wanting special favors for the "American workforce" and not wanting special favors for American Corporations? The two positions are not in disagreement with one another.
I clearly said I favor the marketplace ... that means no government favors ... for anyone.
--
John Pollard
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Because the globalist ilk usually favors all that favors the big multinational corporations.

Should we eliminate all government regulation of the free market and private sector? Should the free market be allowed to govern corporate behavior, such that if a company is unfair to its employees, we'll all work somewhere else? Just curious, how far down that road of the "free market" do you go? I believe the term "free market" is a banner for libertarians that can never be achieved, it's just a cheap bumper sticker slogan.

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What do you mean my "exponentially expand"?

than,
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phrase was used in dramatic license, not for mathematical accuracy. Oracle, Accenture, IBM, and Microsoft are creating thousands of jobs in India.

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John, I would suggest a lot of your assumptions are worth reexamining, given the egregious gaff on this topic. It's not exactly hidden information that Intuit is big in India...
http://www.intuit.com/india/

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Intuit has a major office up here in Edmonton, Alberta, you know.

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Intuit has out sourced its technical support to folks that either don't understand English or have no concept of the system they are supporting. Based on the numerous bugs I have encountered in Quicken 2008 I would have to say the same thing about the programming. It doesn't matter where it is out sourced to -- it does matter the level of competency of the people it is out sourced to.
Here is an excerpt from an email exchange with Quicken support. The problem was that when I printed checks with splits that contained account transfers the transfer accounts wound up with duplicate entries that count not be deleted. You can be the judge of whether or not the Quicken support rep had any idea what he/she was talking about.
My email contained: --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I already used your on-line chat support who's only suggestion was to delete the check registry entries.
After I disconnected from him I was able to develop a solution that did not require me to manually re-enter the check registry transactions. You may want to enter the following work around in your knowledge base until you fix the cause:
1. Copy the check registry transaction and paste it back into the registry. 2. Delete the original check registry transaction. 3. Delete the duplicate entries in the transfer account. You will be able to delete the entries associated with the deleted check registry transaction but not the new one associated with the pasted transaction.
I assume I will have to do that every time I print a check with transfers as part of the split.
Please advise when the bug causing this is fixed. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The response contained: --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I can see that the feature you wish to have can be a useful feature if added to Quicken. Your suggestions are valuable for us to improve and add more features in Quicken program. I am sending you a link where you can send your suggestions regarding Quicken so that more features can be added to Quicken. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
There are a few possibilities: 1. The response was from a bot that was not programmed very well. 2. The response was from a technical support representative that didn't understand the first thing about software and the difference between a suggested work around for a bug and a request for a new feature.
If you can provide a third alternative I would be interested to hear it.

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Stewart Berman wrote:

I think you sent your "suggestion" to the wrong place.
Intuit has links for reporting bugs and reporting product feedback and suggestions. Those links go directly to the people in the organization who can make best use of the information supplied, not to the folks manning internet chats. I think your distinction between suggestion "types" is not material: feedback is feedback, it covers a lot of ground, including your proposed workaround. Trying to get to the top by starting at the bottom is doing it the hard way.
--
John Pollard
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Please try reading the original message again. I only mentioned that I had already tried to get help via the chat line as well. This was not part of the chat conversation. I didn't bother to post the chat conversation as it was worthless.
Tthe email was part of a chain originating with a bug report to quicken: Duplicate Entries In Transfer Account [Incident: 071224-000699]
The individual handling the email is part of the internal support group -- "the people in the organization who can make best use of the information supplied, not to the folks manning internet chats".
Now should the internal support group know the difference between a suggested work around for a bug and a request for a new feature?
I have found that no matter what the reported bug is the response is either:
1. Create a new file and see if you can reproduce it there. 2. Reinstall Quicken into a new directory and see if the problem persists.
I have a problem with One Step Update (yes I have bugged it) that could easily be solved if it had any type of logging built into it -- it apparently doesn't or at less Intuit won't tell me about it. They did however suggest the two items above as usual.

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Stewart Berman wrote:

Your original statement: "Here is an excerpt from an email exchange with Quicken support" didn't make what you've said here clear at all. Anything with the word "support" in it does not sound like what I believed to be true about the submission of bug reports to Intuit's support site.
In the entire time I have used Quicken, and submitted bug reports to their web site, I have never received any replies from them, and they made it clear it was extremely unlikely that anyone would get any replies to a bug report.
So I had every reason to believe that you were still talking to tech support ... especially given the contents of the message you received.

I don't know what the "internal support group" is.
Intuit has said that bug reports go to the developers, not "support", as you have said you were communicating with. I'd wager that the developers, whatever their nationality, would know what your suggestion meant.
If Intuit has changed their policy about responding to bug reports made to their support site, then perhaps they have now got the same people that man the internet chats, responding to bug reports.
It doesn't make any sense to believe the the folks who are supposed to write the code would be spending their days writing emails to the users who submit bug reports.

Gee, I wonder why that is. You don't suppose that if the cause of the problem isn't already clear, that those two responses might have the best chance of eliciting important information or fixing the problem, do you? You don't suppose that Intuit, who receives all the complaints, has some idea of the best responses.
I have given the same responses many times.
And many "reported bugs", aren't.

What? You seem to have all the answers and you haven't figured that out. Been posted many times. [Intuit has also mentioned it in the Quicken forums and it is part of one or more kb articles at Intuit's support site.] If Intuit "won't" tell you, maybe it's your attitude. ;)
--
John Pollard
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The only place I can find to support bug reports is the Quicken Support page. Every time I describe a bug I get a ticket number and a response -- usually meaningless. Apparently this is not forwarded to the development team.
You must have a different URL that you submit bug reports to that I am unaware of. If you would post the URL I would be happy to submit the numerous bugs I have hit in Quicken 2008 H&B.

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Stewart Berman wrote:

I wasn't suggesting that I had some special url where I submitted my bug reports; I think there is only one (not counting the feedback forum in the Quicken Community).
I did say that perhaps Intuit is handling bug reports at that site differently now:
"If Intuit has changed their policy about responding to bug reports made to their support site, then perhaps they have now got the same people that man the internet chats, responding to bug reports."
I have no reason to think that your bug reports aren't getting to the developers; the thing that appears to be new is having conversations with the folks at the Support site feedback link. I do not recall ever getting a live response from there. Here is an excerpt from what I came to expect:
"Your feedback has been recorded. Thank you. We take your comments and suggestions seriously. We can't promise an individual response to your email, but we do respond to customer feedback when we develop products and services, striving to make continual improvements."
I'm not really sure where you were trying to go with your posts in this discussion. It appears you got your submission to Intuit acknowledged which should have pretty much ended the affair; I can't believe you expected them to discuss the fine points of your suggestion, or tell you whether they planned to implement your suggestion (I've made hundreds of suggestions over the years and never expected to be told which they would use and which they wouldn't ... so I haven't been disappointed).
There are few things I'd enjoy more than a sit down with (or at least an email exchange with) some of the Quicken developers, but I think it's just not a realistic wish.
I have seen useful comments from Intuit support personel in the Quicken forums, so if you're looking for responses, I think that's your best bet ... though I still wouldn't hold my breath.
In my experience, the best chance to elicit a useful response from Intuit is to refrain from rancor, and insulting comments about the company, its products and its employees.
And when submitting a post, I wouldn't make it appear I was belittling anyone's communication skills; there are plenty of native born Americans posting who can barely be understood, but to the extent possible, they usually get their questions answered without being publicly looked down on.
--
John Pollard
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John Pollard wrote:

I should have added that I have come reasonably close to getting this wish fulfilled during the times I have beta tested.
Contrary to the opinion of some, beta testing is not a panacea for the solution of product problems; but I think that's your best chance to get your feedback most directly to the developers ... and to get a shot at having a discussion with them ... and have an influence on the resulting product (or subsequent versions).
--
John Pollard
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