CARDS and PINS ..just a thought

In message , Tumbleweed writes

Despite your ridiculous comments elsewhere, I think this is a good idea. Why not write 2 numbers on the card?

...but if they had a gun and are a bit stressed out with the whole thing not going to plan when the card gets swallowed up they might just get an itchy trigger finger...

But yeah it is a good idea so long as you aren't there with the scrap of paper.

Why not use numbers already written (embossed) on the card? There are so many patterns to choose from.

I thought guns were banned in the UK and therefore I am safe from this. That is what my Government told me.

This is the =same= government which puts up 'speed camera' (sorry 'safety camera') signs everywhere there isn't one, and mostly doesn't put them up where there is .. yes??

Same government said that it's illegal to carry a knife in the street too.

Go to any Scuba diving site in the UK (eg Portland, in Dorset), and see this blatantly flouted.

It is only illegal without a lawful reason (or some phrase like that).

Then youve just got to remember the pattern for that card..............

You can use the same pattern for all your cards.

LOL

They have some yellow markings on the floor outside some cash machines

- i think to stop cars parking there.

That's not a bad plan - another idea would be for the banks to issue everyone with two PINs - a real one and a "duress" one. Then even if you are forced to go to the machine and get the cash yourself, you can just use the duress PIN, which will set off alarm bells somewhere etc (but still pay out the cash).

Cheers,

Rody

Rody wrote: ...

That was a standard plan on a security locking system I heard about many years ago. Enter a particular number to be let in; enter a number 1 higher to be let in and trigger a silent alarm system. You don't need to remember two totally different numbers.

Maybe the cash machine system could be alerted and simulate an almost empty account?

Yeah, I considered this, but the problem is that if it this scheme was standard/well known, then the robber would always try one below the number given first to rule out the possibility of a duress number. Better to let customers set it themselves like the standard PIN, then they can use whatever whacky scheme they want (+1,-1,reverse digits,

Again risky if the robber asks you how much you have in your account, or looks through your wallet for slips. The limit for withdrawals at my bank is £300/day (for ATMs - probably higher for counters), so this would limit the amount of direct cash withdrawals anyway.

Cheers,

Rody

"Rody" wrote

The "reveres digits" rule could be fun...

Robber: "Grrr - What is your PIN?" Victim: "It is 1234..."

Now, does robber assume that is the correct PIN and enter it, or assume it is the duress PIN and reverse it?

;-)

"Rody" wrote

Erm, can't you just say "it's nearly empty"?

"Rody" wrote

Never keep them in your wallet!

So if someone asks "nicely" for the PIN, you give a number /2/ higher than the real one :-). If he makes you enter it, you enter the duress PIN.

Mind you, I suspect there'd be an interesting game of bluff and double bluff evolving from this idea.

If you want a simple algorithm instead of just learning a completely different PIN, you should add 5 to or substract 5 from one of digits or perhaps all digits. This way the mugger would not be able to find out which of the two possible PINs is correct. (If it is known that the duress PIN was generated by adding 2, he could test it and do nasty things to you if he found that you gave him the duress PIN first.) For this to work, the ATMs would also have to display consistent information if both the real and the duress PIN were used within, say, a few hours.

Do always keep your separately, or just never request them? I always request them (in case they're later needed for proof in the case of a dispute), especially when using foreign ATMs which I've occasionally had fail half-way through a transaction.

If I didn't keep them in my wallet, they'd end up shoved in a pocket and more likely to be mislaid.

While we're on the topic, I suppose you could always maintain a "duress" wallet, so that if you're robbed, you just hand over the duress wallet which just contains a small amount of cash and some "spare" credit/debit cards. Course, to make it realistic, you'd need to shove a bunch of old receipts, train tickets and business cards in there too :-)

Rody

"Rody" wrote

I never request the slips showing *balances*, just always get the slips showing **withdrawal amount**.

Knowing the previous withdrawal amount won't help the thief; only the true balance would help.