Pre-paid credit cards.

Yes, but it's not a credit card as such. Google "pre-paid Mastercard" for example. As an additional benefit, one of those will also give you access to the actual fares that Ryanair advertise.

They do, except that they don't look like credit cards (to the supplier).

I got one of these cards intending to use it in this way, only to find that it was rejected for the purchase that wanted to make as it wasn't a type of card that they accepted.

Things may be different now though.

tim

They all do. But that's because they're not really credit cards. They're actually debit cards, and will appear as such to the vendor's card handling system. Some hoteliers and rental firms won't take debit cards at all, others will only do so if they can place a hold on the amount of both the full rental bill plus an excess to cover possible damage and extras (eg, in a hotel, the minibar). So you won't be able to do what you suggest, as even if they accept the card you will need to have significantly more funds on it than the actual cost of the bill.

Mark

So if you use an actual credit card and have Guns 'n Roses round for a party in your room, and the ming vase gets smashed, does the credit card company guarantee to cover to cost even if it's way over your credit limit?

No, the amount that can be taken by the hotel is subject to a limit. And that would be very unlikely to cover a Ming vase. Any damage you cause in excess of the limit, therefore, would need to be pursued through the courts in the usual way.

However, the damage limit has nothing to do with your own credit limit. If you caused, say, £500 worth of damage but only had £100 credit left on your card, the card company would pay the full £500 and put you over your limit. If it was a debit card then it would result in an unauthorised (or excess) overdraft.

Mark

I had an issue with my credit card issuer over this once after a hotel made additional charges to my account without my knowledge and resulted in me exceeding my credit limit.

One of the clauses in the terms and conditions of the credit card that I agreed to when I opened the account was to use the card within the credit limit allocated to me. I asked the card company how I was expected to comply with that condition when a merchant was apparently allowed to make random charges to my account without my knowledge or consent.

The script that the person in the call centre was using must have run out at that point, and her agitated response made no sense at all. I never did get a proper answer to that question.

Chris

It quite different from signing a CCA.

With a CCA, I give authority to a merchant who I trust to make regular debits to my account. Its up to me to determine what those amounts will be and when they will be taken.

I have not signed any CCA with the hotel. I am authorising them to make a one-off charge to my account for a specific amount that I sign for when I check-out. As far as I am concerned, that is the only amount I agree to them to taking unless they contact me should there be a need for an additional charge.

If the credit card company is going to allow unauthorised charges to my account without my knowledge then it is quite impossible for me to comply with the terms of my agreement with them that I will not exceed my credit limit.

Chris

Only if the bank had some expectation of such an overdraft being cleared.

If the didn't, they would reject the debit.

tim

No, when you sign a CCA you give them the right to decide what amounts they will take and when they will take them.

No, you have also authorised them to take any further funds necessary to cover any additional costs incurred during your stay.

As far as your credit card company is concered, you have authorised it. The fact that you may have done so out of ignorance is no defence.

Mark

I agree, and that's exactly what I said. My use of the word "determine" was intended to mean "ascertain" in that context, not "decide".

No. I authorise only what I say I authorise. Nobody tells me I have authorised something I haven't agreed to. Some hotels do try to get me to sign an invoice on checking out which reads something to the effect:

"I agree that my liability for this bill is not waived and agree to be held personally liable in the event that the indicated person or company failed to pay for any part or full amount of these charges."

I always cross that statement through now before signing it. If the hotel doesn't like it they had better decide pretty fast what they believe I owe them because I'm not leaving them with a blank cheque to fill in later.

Again, I have authorised exactly what I have signed to say I am authorising. Nothing else.

Chris

Right, I see what you mean now.

That's a different issue, and if you're trying to avoid any responsibility for damage debits then you're crossing out the wrong bit. What you're actually crossing out is the part which makes you liable in the event that the card company, for whatever reason, refuses to pass on your payment to them. I'm not entirely sure that you could actually decline that liability, since it doesn't need to be agreed to in order to exist.

What you need to find, and delete, is the section which allows them to take funds to cover any damage or other expenses incurred during your stay. But you'll be signing up to that right at the start, during the check in, and I suspect that if you do try to delete it they will simply decline to let you have the room.

Mark

What happens if they agreed in advance either over the phone or by email to let you have the room with no exclusion clauses stated. They cannot then introduce new terms after the contract has been concluded. (Olley v The Marlborough Court Hotel).

You still owe them the money for the room. If you're not prepared to pay it in a form acceptable to them (eg, a credit card on which they can levy a damage charge if necessary), then you are in breach of the contract and they have no obligation to supply the room.

Mark

If no specific form of payment is stipulated in the original contract, surely legal tender, e.g. cash, has to be accepted in settlement. Cards are not legal tender so why should the hotel be able to insert the term (payment by card) after the contract has been concluded?

No, because it's not a debt as the service has not yet been provided. And, in any case, the legal requirement to accept legal tender is rather more constrained than many people (including, it would appear, you) think it is.

The contract hasn't been concluded.

Mark

I don't believe I've ever signed such an agreement at check-in. I do sign a registration form, but I don't recall seeing anything there that allows them to make further charges to my credit card without my authorisation.

Some hotels I stay at are prepaid using vouchers provided by online reservation services so no credit card is needed in those cases. In fact many people don't have credit cards at all. If what you are saying is correct then none of those people would ever be able to stay at hotels.

Chris

I have stayed at hotels which did not even take credit cards.

Apart from the prepaid card route - What stops you (once you learn of the added charge) from ringing the headphone monkeys at the credit card company and saying that you dispute the charge, and that it should be refunded to you immediately?

I seem to recall reading somewhere that you are buying the "goods" from the credit card company, and "if you aint had 'em, then they cannot charge you fer 'em"

Please, all you who know more about things, set flames to off, I would like to know the answer too!