Quicken 2008: Tags vs. Classes

David - and any others : What was the 'problem' they were trying to solve? Maybe I am missing the point (I do know from one of another posts one can have multiple 'tags' per transaction), but I'm confused. Does the tags "enhancement" provide meaningful improvement in organizing or tracking ?

Another question - Intuit is advertising an enhancement of "You can also add extra details to any expense to help jog your memory -- i.e., the specific restaurant for a dining expense or the trip destination for an airline ticket." - didn't the NOTES facility already allow you to do that? I use a GREEN Flag to indicate that there is a note associated with that transaction, and now I fear that I will have to change all those to this 'new' facility, or not use it to avoid mix and matching. What's the difference? (I really don't want to hear it's just a different way of doing the same thing without additional benefits).

I'm somewhat concerned that they did not provide any real meaningful updates to this release - and this is the first time since using one of the original DOS versions of Quicken since the mid 1980s that I don't see any enhancements worth going to, and in fact, it's regressing features that I've used in the past without any improvements in what is being offered as a replacement as far as I can see from afar.

This is typical of software that have matured to a point that new features being added provide additional 'bloatware' without redeeming benefits. Happens quite often with software that has releases over time.

Please someone tell me I'm wrong (with details) and that 2008 is worth moving up to from 2007 versions!

I don't really know what was wrong with the old Classes method that they had to change it to Tags. I used Classes only very lightly. But, even though Intuit's Help file says "tags are an improved and expanded version of classes," I don't see any difference except the UI. Maybe someone who used Classes more than I did can see the difference.

Regarding Notes, I didn't even know there was such a facility. Of course, I came from Quicken 2005, so maybe (if I'm not to be embarrassed), Notes weren't implemented there. Anyway, Notes and Flags are still in Quicken

2008.

As for "meaningful updates," I only upgraded because 1) Quicken 2005 was sunsetting, and 2) I was having continual "stopped responding" problems with Quicken 2005 under Vista Ultimate (32-bit). I actually had to uninstall '05 from Vista and run it under an XP Virtual Machine. Workable, but slow and cumbersome. With 2008, I had one "stopped responding" problem shortly after I installed it (when I first hit the My Savings Plan button for the first time). Since then, everything's run fine. However, my biggest gripe with Intuit's upgrade dance is that they always seem to JUST change the UI and leave all the long-standing bugs and deficiencies in place. From what I can see with this release, the UI isn't TOO different from previous versions (which is good). I haven't used it long enough to see if the actual "ledger" side of the program works any better or worse. The official Quicken Community board does have some threads running saying that some high visibility bugs haven't been fixed (screen flicker and net worth values come to mind).

Dave

I found classes to be a pain as far as data entry went. Tried them and reverted back to creating categories. The big problem is the classes where off my radar...meaning that I couldn't see them (long category names) and they "would stick" when I changed categories. I ended up spending too much time correcting transactions because of this.

I may resume using tags because it is a separate data entry field that is more visible. Have not had time to experiment with this yet.

I don't think there is anything major in this upgrade by my system seems my stable then Q2007 Premier running under Vista Ultimate. I haven't had a crash in one step update and my Bank of America Express Web Connect has "magically" started working - meaning that it now is downloading transaction detail in addition to Account Balances.

Chester - good point. But of course their website gives their marketing spin on these "enhancements'; I rely a lot of the combined thoughts and valued (of post posters) here in the NG prior before I buy anyway.

I wasn't aware of the Notes or Flags either. I've used Quicken for a LONG time, currently Q2007. The Memo filed has always been sufficient for me rather than Notes, and the Memo field can be searched. Now that I know about them the Flag may be useful.

In all these years I've never needed Classes and simply found them to add a layer of complexity to the way we use Quicken. For categories where it matters I have something like Clothes:Mine and Clothes:Wife which is very easy to understand, enter and report on. For business perhaps I'm fortunate but I've always used separate checking and/or credit cards and even if there was any intermingling, categories were completely sufficient.

Bernie

For only one catagory, use of 'wife' and 'mine' is certainly sufficient, but when you start with auto expenses, lunches, grooming, etc. etc., all the categories you'd have to duplicate with whatever:mine and whatver:wife. I find the use of classes to be very useful to itemize expenses either to a particular person or a particular automobile (I have four of them in my family, so /CAMRY, /CORROLA, /CIVIC, and /VOYAGER get good usage); I also use it to indicate the income or expense is not mine at all (/MISCELLANEOUS, /CLUB, etc.), but rather I am owed or owe the income or expense from some other payee (such as a club expense as a passthru) and exclude them from my personal reports since the cash flow is not 'mine'.

As far as flags are concerned, I think I mentioned this before, but I use the 'red' flag to indicate that I need to continue to 'close' the transaction (like someone owes me the money for it, or whatever), whereas 'Green' is simply to indicate there's an INFORMATIONAL point attached (like an explanation). The idea is to eliminate all the RED flags over time.

Just a couple of ideas here how *I* use classes and flags. YMMV. Other ideas welcomed!

This is a pretty facile reply. If you decide you don't like the new features, falling back is very hard to do. Running two Quicken versions on the same machine (if at all do-able) is really hard.

At some point in time you could run >1 version of Quicken at the same time. It was as messy as heck and played havoc with starting Quicken and preventing file conversions and whatnot, but it could be done. I don't recall if Intuit made it easier or harder in the intervening years.

Trying that sounds like a recipe for disaster.

I seem to recall >> I don't think you can run both versions on one machine. You should know

Actually, you can. Intuit doesn't recommend it (which is why the newer versions want to delete other versions during the install process), but it can be done.

There are can be some (usually) minor problems, but I have always been able to work around them. (There may have been one exception to this, but I can't prove the problem was caused by multiple versions of Quicken installed.)

[My general observation is that the most recently installed version seems to experience the fewest effects.]

I currently have Q2002, Q2004, Q2007 and Q2008 installed on one machine. I run the newer ones almost every day, the older ones probably once a week or so.

"John Pollard" wrote in news:u9zCi.83255$Fc.37534 @attbi_s21:

I run my files from a shortcut to the qdf file. Do I guess right that doing so will always start the most recent version of Quicken, and I will have to change my habits?

I presume that you install Quicken in a different directory for each version.

I think clicking on a file will run the program assigned to that file extension in Windows Explorer (Tools > Folder Options > File Types). Only one program can be assigned to a specific file extension, but you would have to insure that it was the most current Quicken executable. [Theoretically, the Quicken Install makes that assignment, but I think that process has been known to fail on occasion. And it gets dicier when you are installing/re-installing multiple Q versions.]

I put the file name I want to open when I start Quicken in the "Target" field of the "Properties" of the Quicken executable desktop icon. I leave one space after the name of the Quicken executable, then enter the fully qualified name of the data file. You can have multiple such desktop icons, running different Quicken versions and each set to open a different Quicken file, appropriate to the version.

Yes, no choice there.

"John Pollard" wrote in news:JvBCi.66418$Xa3.45468 @attbi_s22:

Thanks, John!

The real question is whether Intuit does the QA tests for such an installation. If they do not, then I would rather not subject my data to it.

Thanks for that pointer. I just assumed I'd lose all use of classes/tags if I turned off the option. I did as you did and my registers are back the way they were pre-Q08. Much nicer. Thanks, again.

Dave

I also find classes very useful. As mentioned, some things that could be subcategories really span categories. If I buy clothing or music or movie tickets, I can have categories as I see fit. But if I buy clothing/daughter, I can figure out all the expenses for my daughter, as well as all the expenses for clothing, and expenses for my daughter could include any category. You can get as detailed as you want with categories. You can have dining:tip, or dining:chinese:soup if you want, and it might be unlikely that you would track soup in the entertainment or household category also. But if you go on vacation to Vermont, then Dining/Vermont, gas/Vermont,etc. will allow you to track your trip expenses, still let you track your annual gasoline costs. And Clothing/Vermont:daughter will allow you to track expenses for your daughter, expenses on your trip, and clothing expenses, all as separate entities.

Categories are for breaking things down into detail, while classes are about putting things back together. And subclasses are not really subclasses. Clothing/daughter:Vermont works the same as above and the classes remain independent, while subcategories are dependent upon a hierarchy. So if you were in the soup business and really wanted to track soup, dining/soup and groceries/soup would make sense for you.

Plus, if you go on that Vermont trip, you won't want to go through your existing categories, and add subcategories for what will be used for a brief time, just to use a colon instead of a slash.

The only problem with classes is the lack of clarity for many users.