Changing Money

There is a security risk in providing your address to a stranger before going on holiday.

Its typical CYA on behalf of the organsiations, and typical british beauracracy following a rule to a ridiculous extent. Leads to things such as your example, and 85 year olds being not allowed to buy alcohol in Asda (or wherever it was) unless they can prove they are over 18.

I changed 400 on Friday in an Eastbourne Bureau de Change . The bored lady hardly uttered a word during the transaction. Earlier this year I twice changed larger amounts for Aussie Dollars in M&S in Brighton and Eastbourne and they wanted my passport and address. George.

So if you do not have a passport you are denied access to foreign currency?

Well, if you don't have a passport, you don't need foreign currency.

"Ronald Raygun" wrote

Could be buying something from abroad & posting foreign notes to pay for it?

Might have been paid for something in foreign currency from a tourist here in UK, and want to exchange it for Sterling?

Ugh. Dodgy. Get a friend with a passport to buy it for you? Buy the notes from a tourist?

Use his own bank rather than a standalone bureau de change? The bank will already have done all the ML vetting on him, and will probably also offer a better exchange rate. Find a friend who could use the currency?

I suppose not having any friends could be a problem.

Not so and my mother for example buys dollars to send to my brother as a present.

But even if one could successfully argue that, is it reasonable grounds to deny its purchase?

I do hope you are joking as using cash to purchase low value foreign goods is pretty standard stuff when no "better" method can be agreed between the parties.

All we are talking about here is buying a few quids worth of foreign currency! Why on earth should anyone need to be "vetted"?

How does anybody (other than yourself) know you are not making many of these transactions?

"PeterSaxton" wrote

Why would it matter, even if they were?

Money laundering concerns.

Even if you were, why shouldn't you be?

I don't see why exchanging foreign currency is any more an indication of money laundering than dealing with cash in Sterling. I could go out and buy a car for several thousand Pounds, pay for it in cash, and nobody would be at all suspicious. I could repeat that several times and still not have to account for what I was doing. But as soon as I want to change £200 into Euros I've got to produce a passport to identify myself.

Money laundering is about moving money around to hide its original source. The fact that a conversion to a foreign currency is involved has little irrelevance.

Chris

Nobody is saying that exchanging foreign currency is any more an indication of money laundering than dealing with cash in Sterling

It's not a question of suspicion rather it's a question of following the regulations.

Buying and selling cars is a prime example of money laundering. You say people may not be suspicious. That is either through ignorance or because there are no grounds to be suspicious but one person may not be able to see the whole picture.

This is from HMRC:

High Value Dealers such as Car Dealerships

Money Service Businesses such as Bureaux de Change

The 2003 Money Laundering Regulations apply to most businesses in the financial sector, and the Money Laundering Regulation (MLR) regime is designed to help ensure that those businesses which HM Customs supervise have systems in place to prevent money laundering and to report suspicious transactions.

HM Customs are responsible for supervising:

• Money Service Businesses or MSBs - these are bureaux de change, money transmitters and third party cheque cashers and

• High Value Dealers or HVDs - these are businesses that deal in goods and accept (or are prepared to accept) in cash the equivalent of EURO 15,000 or more (approximately £10,000) for any single transaction.

If you are an MSB or HVD you need to:

• register with H.M.C. & E.

• pay an annual fee based on the number of premises through which you trade

• report changes during the registration year and

• put anti money laundering systems in place so that you can identify and prevent money laundering and report any suspicious transactions.

Registration packs

You can get a registration pack by telephoning the National Advice Service on 0845 010 9000. There are separate packs for MSBs and for HVDs, and each includes:

• Registration Notice

• Anti Money Laundering Guide

• Form MLR100

• Form MLR102

• A video about registration and anti money laundering systems, and

• A reply paid envelope for your application

Anti money laundering systems

The purpose of these systems is to enable you to identify and prevent money laundering and to report suspicious transactions to the National Criminal Intelligence Service (NCIS). These systems will help you to defend yourself against money launderers and against charges of money laundering. You should read the anti money laundering information notice, which explains these systems

New regulations are coming in soon.

This may help you understand money laundering better.

"PeterSaxton" wrote

Don't you think it seems a bit silly to require extra constraints when a 'bureaux de change' changes 200 into the equivalent euros, but not for a shopkeeper accepting 250 in payment for an item costing (say) 20 and giving the change in euros (where the regs don't apply because it is not a 'high value' transaction)...?

What regulations don't apply? If there is any transaction a person is suspicious of they should notify NCIS. The shopkeeper may not have the person's name and address but CCTV can be looked at.

You might have thought so but apparently not - I paid a cheque in to my account last week for a relatively large amount (£13k) which had been issued by funnily enough Northern Rock i.e. not a personal account cheque but a cheque payable to me drawn on Northern Rock.

Now you would have thought that a bank would have no interest in the source of the funds as they were coming from another bank so any laundering would have taken place when the funds were paid into the account at Northern Rock e.g. cash.

But no - "what do these funds represent" (and no it was not can we ask a financial adviser to speak to you) as they specifically advised they were obliged to do so under money laundering regulations.

One wonders how long it will be until cash is banned.

"PeterSaxton" wrote

Duh - the ones that *you* just quoted! [Or are you going to say that you didn't quote them, because you didn't put them in quotation marks?!]

"PeterSaxton" wrote

I refer you to your own earlier comment (see top of this post) :- "PeterSaxton" wrote: It's not a question of suspicion rather it's a question of following the regulations.

Those particular regulations don't need to be followed by the shopkeeper, because they only apply to MSBs and HVDs... [I was referring to a shopkeeper who is neither a MSB nor a HVD.]

Now would you like to answer my previous question?

What are you talking about?

If a shopkeeper sells something for £20 and accepts £250 and then gives Euro's without being registered to do so they are behaving as an unregistered MSB. They are breaking many laws not just the anti-money laundering legislation.