Another limit to be aware of ..

Solicitors sometimes offer the option to charge by the hour instead of by percentage, especially if you do some of the leg (paper) work yourself, such as compiling the list of assets including obtaining certificates of balances from banks at date of death.

Do you think they have insurance against this? Would they not expect

Frankly, it seems odd that banks would release any funds at all, never mind as much as £15k, without probate, unless the deceased had arranged for you have authority to sign on his accounts. Otherwise you could conceivably be anybody, and the banks would have to have the facility to do a fair bit of work to verify your entitlement - almost the same job as probate court has to do.

I may be missing something, but will add something & IANAL

IIRC, banks will release funds from the deceased's accounts before probate for at least two reasons:

1. funeral expenses
2. to pay inheritance tax (but only by paying direct to the Inland Revenue) so that probate can be obtained. using form D20 (see e.g.
   formatting link
   ) Allan

Yep, that's one option, although their hourly rates are pretty steep too.

Yes, with different banks, I believe it is a 'per institution' limit,, not 'per account'.

I bet they either have insurance, or self insure. You are liable if you mis-execute the estate, they must be liable if they give the estate assets to completely the wrong person.

Nope, it's quite normal I gather, as long as you show up with the death certificate, the Will, and the funds are being released to somewhere halfway sane (like the beneficiary or executor named in the will). AFAIK they Ên't= even insist on probate for amounts

Ah! Where there's a will, there's a way. I was thinking of the more awkward intestacy situation. I think that's the one where the bond of caution is needed, in case someone turns up later and says either that you overlooked some heirs, or that there is a will after all, and all your intestate executry was to pot, and meanwhile the heirs have spent all their bounty on sake and geishas.

Another solution is to put enough money into National Savings certificatesetc. These can be used to pay the inheritance tax without limit.

Robert

In this case there's a clear Will, the Executrix is the only beneficiary (and spouse) all other assets are joint (and have been for 30 years), and still the wretched HBOS require probate to be gone through for this one ISA. Like I said, they're off my Xmas list.

LLoyds bank, who I normally have little time for, were actually superb in this instance - they actually volunteered a chip+sig debit card (with a PIN for ATM use only) which was an option I wasn't aware of ... another wrinkle for our readers: joint Credit Cards go down the pan with the deceased if the deceased was the primary card holder and credit agreement signatory (leaving spouse etc. with no credit cards).

I've told the beneficiary to sell the (joint) HBOS shares (from the demutualization X years ago) and buy Lloyds shares, based on customer service alone. HBOS am doomed, doomed I tell you .. 8>.

So after the charge on one [TO]ISA you're only left with 94.6% ?!

Outrageous.

Daytona

In message , Ronald Raygun writes

The banks will do it but only against a personal indemnity from the personal representative of the deceased against any future claims.

Full ID, site of will (if any), death cert etc., will obviously also be required together with proof of relationship to the deceased if thought necessary.

That sounds reasonable enough. GSV, are HBOS likely to play ball on that basis?

Nope, like I said 'more than their jobsworth', besides which it's impossible to find anyone high enough up the organization to have any discretion who will actually talk to a customer.

I tried the 'who do I talk to' and 'who set the 15k limit anyway, and 'why has it been 15k for the last N years' and got blankness back (with a Scottish accent). Already offered them whatever indemnity that wanted to ask for .. 'can't be dun Jon' was about all they could say.

The £90 is actually minor compared to the hassle of filling in the forms** and driving 30+ miles to the nearest probate interview site. What's not minor is the charges if you get someone else to take on the hassle. if it were just £90 I'd be less displeased (still not deliriously happy, because it's £90 that needn't be spent).

(** Do you know you parent's aunts/uncles, number of, and number of offspring therefrom in the event aunt/uncle predeceased your parent? Now I know why genealogy is big business).

In message , GSV Three Minds in a Can writes

I am at a bit of a loss here to understand the point.

The bit about joint accounts is irrelevant because they automatically vest in the survivor.

Are you saying that ownership of any item owned by the deceased, regardless of value, should just be paid away to anybody who turns up with a bit of paper headed 'last will & testament' and a Death Cert?.

The law is quite clear that will need to be proven in probate in order to be valid. There is a cost, which isnt all that much. Sadly, when somebody dies, certain costs are incurred, such as funeral expenses, drinks for the mourners etc., I see no reason why proving a will in probate should be free. Also, IME whilst the local Probate office may be a distance away, they have regular remote days at lots of different locations throughout their area so most people dont have far to travel at all.

Technically, Probate is needed for any amount

What do you suggest they should do instead?

In message , john boyle writes

I have found a couple of links indicating what some other institutions do

Bitstring , from the wonderful person john boyle said

Update the 15k limit in line with inflation. Apply some flexibility when they have £x0k in joint accounts, a Will saying that everything should go to the second joint a/c holder (=spouse, = executor), and just one one ISA which would have been joint ,if a joint ISA was possible.

Actually I didn't suggest anything originally, I just pointed out that having >15k in an ISA will cause you avoidable grief, at least with HBOS.

In message , GSV Three Minds in a Can writes

Generally, the 'probate office' will be a council office used for the day by a visiting probate officer. If you find the website that lists the probate centres, as well as the main ones there are also subsidiary ones that get a visit maybe once a week.

Bitstring , from the wonderful person " snipped-for-privacy@privacy.net" said

There's a list on the leaflet they send you on 'how to fill in the form', however even the nearest interview centre (which as you say, is a place they occasionally visit) is ~20 miles away.

Tell them the executrix is unable to travel, due to disability or infirmity, and would they mind coming to her, or alternatively would it be possible for you to represent her at interview.

Presumably travelling 20 miles will be less of a problem for a strapping youngster like yourself than for her.

In message , GSV Three Minds in a Can writes

Suppose you said the execturix is physcially incapacitated, could you convince them to visit her instead?

I was thinking much the same thing.

I am sure that nobody would give us *any* of my father's money without the probate certificate.

The bank helpfully suggested that one thing that they would do is to pay the funeral bill from the account if we were strapped for it.

(We weren't, but we chose that option anyway and then the stupid buggers forgot to pay it. - The nice Mr Smith who has, over the years, burried most of my mother's very large family had to contact us to see why his bill hadn't been paid!)

tim