Credit Cards/Chip and Pin/ATM withdrawls

Which means there are 10000 combinations, ranging from 0000 to 9999.

Too late :-)

Ok.

Suppose it is a direct debit?

To you in the first case.

If you are not satisfied, then to the financial ombudsman when you take your complaint there.

Peter Crosland posted

Because there are many ways in which crooks can find your PIN. Shoulder surfing (forget winged terminals, go to my local Halfords, and that's just *one* of the worst culprits); phoney card-skimming terminals; robbery with violence.

I have read of dozens more technical means but can't say how effective they might be now or in two years time.

With chip and pin an individual customer might get stuck with several thousands of pounds direct liability for some fraudulent transactions. These are the bank's gain and the customer's loss.

Random guessing is not the way it will be done.

That'll lead to a few trolleyfuls of food being left at Sainsbury's checkout because I don't have a PIN . We shall see what happens after that. Especially if Asda says it *does* accept chip and sig.

4.xml "Money surgery: Barclays plays fast and loose with chip and pin By Liz Dolan (Filed: 14/12/2005) Imagine how you'd feel if you discovered that a large amount of money had vanished from your current account - and that your bank expected you to foot the bill. When this happened to Sophia Davis at the beginning of September, she immediately contacted the police. But Barclays failed to sign the police form (it has never said why) and launched an internal inquiry instead. And so the nightmare began. The case ... centres on the theft of around £2,000 withdrawn on seven days over a 10-day period in August. Virtually all the disputed withdrawals were made at around 10pm some 25 miles from Sophia's Hertfordshire home. The fraud investigators concluded that Sophia was either directly involved in the theft, or at the very least, had allowed it to happen through gross negligence. Evidence thrown up by chip and pin technology had left no room for doubt, a spokesman said."

IIUC you get 3 attempts to enter a PIN. Therefore the chances of a correct guess on one of the attempts is 1 in 3333.

PeteM wrote: ...

It will be interesting. I have a chip&sig debit card; this regularly comes up as "pin blocked" or "pin not enabled" [whatever that is!] on local terminals, including tesco iirc. I've /already/ had the card rejected completely at one local store - fortunately, my chip&sig credit card (different bank) worked.

The bank says the card is fine and that the retailer's equipment must be faulty. I begin to feel like piggy in the middle.....

But it's still your problem :-) /You/ are the only one who is supposed to know the PIN. Therefore if the PIN is used, /you/ must have revealed it to someone either deliberately or negligently.

"TD" wrote

Wouldn't you cancel the DDeb after you get the statement, before the due date?

I meant, what if the money disappears directly from your bank account?

But you have already answered my question.

"PeteM" wrote

l

But read down the article a bit :- "The bank has now reluctantly offered to repay 1,810 ... the money will soon be winging its way to Sophia's new current account - with First Direct."

So, it appears that the customer won, not the bank!

Just do what I do. Shop at supermarket, they require PIN. I stick pin in, and then *immediately* phone the bank on the mobile to report the comprimise due to the camera watching the pin keypad....

Cameras in ASDA have now been moved and the bank got so sick of it they gave me a signature card.

12V applied to the terminals will trash a chip.

but a strong magnet used to

You are wrong! The customer is not responsible for fraudulent transactions. Go and read any UK credit card issuer's terms and conditions to confirm this.

In what way would the bank gain? Do you have any understanding of basic economics? Any losses the bank incur will reduce their profits. The end result is that charges, which get passed on to customers, are likely to rise.

Peter Crosland

In article , Tim writes

Only because the press got involved.

Mike Scott wrote

I applied for a C&P card as soon as they became available, mainly because hardly any till operators seem to check signatures, IME.

Peter Crosland posted

I don't need to, it's in the 1974 act. However, that doesn't stop the bank *holding* the customer responsible (on the basis "Chip and pin is invulnerable, these transactions were PIN-authenticated, therefore you authenticated them, therefore you'r eliable") and causing him a huge amount of hassle.

By persuading the customer to accept the bank's liability. This won't work on customers who know about the 1974 Act, but will work on sufficient of them that it's worth the bank trying the swindle on.

That happens to some extent. But it's not as bad as being stuck with a £2000 liability, as Barclays tried to do with Sophia Davis.

There is NO change to possible liability of the customer with chip and pin.

So your statement is either false, or it is equally true without chip and pin.