At Sainsbubbles today I put my debit card in the slot and it came up with the message 'swipe card' - The assistant took it out, cleaned it, put it back - and it still came up 'swipe card'.
She then swiped it - and it prompted me for my PIN.
Does swipe and PIN work, or was this chip, swipe and PIN ?
At 16:47:33 on 16/09/2006, Miss L. Toe delighted uk.finance by announcing:
That sounds like a technical fallback.
That sounds dodgy.
Absolutely not.
There's no reason for the machine to request a swipe if the chip is working. If the chip's not working, there should be no request for the PIN. In your shoes, I would have refused to enter my PIN.
This happens to the customers I'm serving quite often. I've never know the swipe fail once the card's then been handed to me. There's as many theories as to why this happens as there are customers ;)
In Tesco they always swipe the card, then ask me to enter my PIN. Elsewhere, mostly, they stick the card in the chip and PIN reader. Probably to do with how the software was written. I wouldn't worry too much about it. Also I've noticed that after entering the PIN, some chip and PIN readers say that I can remove the card immediately, whilst others make me wait 10 seconds whilst they are "processing". Again it depends on the acquirer.
Occasionally Tesco don't ask for the PIN, instead printing out a signature slip. The checkout operator had no idea why last time this happened to me.
At 21:06:35 on 16/09/2006, BrianW delighted uk.finance by announcing:
You'll find that Tesco use hybrid swipe'n'park readers. The card is read magnetically as it's swiped, then the chip is read as it's 'parked' at the end of the track. This is so the operator doesn't have to worry about whether it's a chip card or not; the POS takes care of it.
It will depend on both the issuer and acquirer.
Well they wouldn't, but it will be either because the chip couldn't be processed (whether that's because of a fault with the chip or the reader) or there was a fault with the PINpad.
As someone mentioned, in Tesco the machine that reads the CHIP is on the end of the traditional swipe part (at the bottom) - so most of the time it will go to C+P but if there is not Chip then it will go for sig.
In our Tesco there could be a few reasons why the till is used instead of the standalone machine
1) Tesco spent loods of money on the chip readers just before C+P took (and the Pin readers arrived) off so they decided to use their investment
2) Initally they knew there would be delays with people not understanding the system so they let the cashier take the card as normal
3) The cashier will swipe the clubcard anyway so may as well do the payment card (again, the new readers were installed before many clubcards had barcodes on the back - still many people have the magnetic only clubcards)
The reason why it sometimes goes to Sig is almost certainly a fault with the chip reader on the till or the C+P bit that you stick your Pin into (assuming this is a C+P enabled card)
Most people now know to give the card to the cashier at Tesco or they try and put in into the machine as you would in most other shops - this one time I had a guy who refused to give me his C+P card because he didn't want me to come in contact with the card (not because he hated me!) - he was give 2 choices, either sign for it or get lost. He chose to sign for it (and I had to take his card)
At 22:16:34 on 16/09/2006, JoJo delighted uk.finance by announcing:
There is no standalone machine in Tesco; the POS performs every transaction and uses the PINpad only to accept the PIN.
The reason the POS is used instead of this, though, is because it's not possible for the PINpad to perform the transaction; it simply doesn't have the processing capacity or communications capability. It is controlled by the POS via its serial link and its sole function is to accept a PIN.
It *could* be used to read the card as well as accepting the PIN but this would require more training for the operators, and more thought if something goes wrong with the reading of the chip.
As for the other reasons:
1) EMV was on the way years before Tesco implemented their hybrid readers; the first 'production' specification was EMV 3.11 released in
1996. Tesco always planned to use hybrid readers because it requires less training for the operators.
2) Same as 1.
3) This is no reason; the customer can swipe their clubcard on a PINpad just as easily as they can swipe/insert their card. There's no *need* for an operator to touch any card at all.
Thats what I meant (to read the card - the way Tesco reads the card is different from most shops - where they usually let you stick the card into the reader yourself) - what more do you want from the 'machine' other than the ability to read the card and take input of the PIn - i realise the actual software processes it.
Fair enough - but its not like its rocket science- almost every single other shop takes the Pin the other way (user inserts and removes their own card) - i worked at another shop where this was the case when C+P was really gathering pace and it was mayhem because everyone had different ideas on what to do with the cad - in the end we just took the card off them and stuck it into the machine for them - but now its gotten to the point where most people will do this anyway so its not that hard for Tesco to go to the 'usual' system if they want to.
Fair point, but for some reason I have a feeling Tesco will keep making the cashier take hold of the clubcard for various reasons - so at least one half the the tranaction will involve handing a card over (assuiming someone pays with a credit/debit card and uses their clubcard) - therefore it probably becomes easier for the cashier to do both anyway.
At 23:59:45 on 16/09/2006, JoJo delighted uk.finance by announcing:
Well, you may want it to process the entire transaction, store the batch, communicate with the host, etc. Tesco wouldn't want this, of course, since they already have the ability to do this. It would be more typical in a smaller retailer.
I was in a Sainsbury's' petrol station 2 days ago. When I handed over my card I was told "we're expecting all customers to put the card in the machine themselves now".
They can expect what they like. It ain't gonna happen.
It wasn't me then - I was asked and refused to hand my card to the Waitrose cashier for her to place in in the slot, only for her to push the terminal back to me for the PIN (poor design or what). I was given two choices, so I walked.
There is no reason at all for a cashier in Waitrose to take the card unless it fails to register in the reader.
This does smack of paranoia to me. What do you think the Waitrose cashier will do? Make an illicit copy, or memorise the card number for future use? I can see why you wouldn't want a restaurant to take your card round the back somewhere, but I can't see the risk here, as the card won't leave your sight.
The cashier looks at the card and reads my name - under normal circumstances this does not now appear on their receipts. I don't want the cashier knowing she served Mr so and so or asking why my card is black etc.
That is why they sometimes like to hold it up to the light, mention it's different, show the World. I could do without that. C&P should reduce the interaction with the cashier in the way ATM's reduced interaction with bank staff.
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