Any recommendations for an online bank? I need a bank offering the usual free banking and reasonable interest on savings but also the ability to download to Microsoft Money. I started using Smile but then found out you can't download data like I currently do with Barclays. Also, a decent clear screen display would be good - I was surprised that Smile is done via a small sub-window and it's like doing it through a letterbox! Oh, and of course, a human to talk to when things go wrong.
I agree, I was shocked because in every other aspect they are excellant - but considering they market themselves purely as an internet bank they have one of the crapest online interfacecs I have seen. RBS and Natwest have identical online banking and it really is very good - they are complete fascists though so I refuse to give them any of my money any more - shame really.
Have you sent a message to smile? I had heard they are improving their interface. They may also be able to help with downloading info from the account.
Yes, they are dumping the 'popup window' approach. That means they'll be nobbling the main browser window, which is slightly worrying (the reason they use a popup window is for security - you'll note the absence of most of the normal window functions.).
It was a good idea and I hadn't thought of it! Anyway, I spoke to them and they say they do not intend to offer downloads as it's not safe. They say they are the safest online bank for a reason! I am closing my account and moving to the Nationwide.
] begin GSV Three Minds in a Can's quote in uk.finance about: Re: Good online banking [Smile bank]
Hmm, I've always called that *less* secure.
Say FooBank's online banking works in a popup window (yuk). FooBank customers are acclimatised to this happening.
One day, Phred Phisher sends a bogus email to a FooBank customer, 'click here' (or a particularly cunning virus hijacks the http connection and redirects it somewhere else).
FooBank customer doesn't notice that the link whose image-as-text alleged itself to be:
formatting link
actually pointed to:
formatting link
(Admittedly, anybody who follows links in emails without even a casual glance, deserves all that they get.)
Said page is a clone of the the banking page, "complete" *without* (as it were) such necessities as the addressbar and statusbar.
FooBank's customer is none the wiser that they're not where they thought they were.
Ouch. And a costly ouch, at that.
I *always* like to have all browser features available so that I can be sure that I am where I thought I was, and that all links give clues as to where they point to.
(For that reason, I dislike browsing on WAP devices, you don't know where you are, can't tell where you're going, and can't easily tell if you've been there already, without those clues. "You are in a long winding tunnel. Thorin appears and starts singing about gold.")
Luckily, my preferred browser allows me to reassemble the parts of the browser window that clueless d3zyn3rs have stripped away.
If the user is daft enough to try to use the normal browser navigation features during a banking session (ie, back/forward), that shouldn't be a problem. Whatever mechanism the banking system uses to record state should recognise the problem, reply "Don't do that, then" and return them to the previous expected page. Most online shopping sites, which have similar needs to record state, don't behead themselves in this way.
Thanks to all that contributed to this with advice - very interesting and helpful. I made a similar enquiry on another newsgroup and the overriding recommendation was the Nationwide. Having checked out their demo etc I have signed up with them for a new account. It looks like it does all I need. Their customer support on the phone was good too.
The problem is that most people will be using Microsoft email software and Phred Phisher will send the bogus email in a html format.
On the screen it will actually say
formatting link
but the (hidden) link will be to
formatting link
The scams I've seen recently use a copy of the bank's opening web page and then put a pop-up window asking for username and password - for new security purposes. After filling in your details they then pass you to the legitimate web page for the bank.
] begin Alan's quote in uk.finance about: Re: Good online banking
Thunderbird does the same (my previous emailer only showed the text parts of HTML messages, so I hadn't previously realised quite how ingenious these look-alike emails actually are)
Don't the various versions of Outlook show the real URL in the status bar when you hover over it? Thunderbird does show the link, which is an important clue.
I admit it's a cunning scam that will doubtlessly fool some people, but anybody who doesn't check that a link is actually going where it claims to be going (especially now such phishing scams are well-highlighted) should be more cautious.
That is quite clever. Hopefully the banks will be learning from this and will stop using popup windows where the real location can be hidden.
The first context-menu item in a popup window is "Show Menubar", which you can then use to redisplay all the other standard browser toolbars.
Depending on the nature of the link to/generation of the popup in the original browser window (if you know it will occur), using context-menu: "Open Link in New Window" rather than just selecting the link will usually create a new *proper* window, overriding the JavaScript dehancements. :)
There may well be an extension for Moz/Firebird which does similar to Konqi's "Show Menubar", or it may be fairly trivial to write one. (I've not researched how Moz extensions work)
When dealing with any bank, or company, I always you an email address of the form bank_name@domain_name.co.uk where the domain name is one never used in a public forum and so never attracts spam Any of these bogus bank security requests addressed to any of my other email identities is easily identified as a scam
OK, thanks, I don't use KDE but (at least on my Linux box) I think I can run Konqueror.
That's a bit like I can do in Mozilla using the tabbed browsing, middle clicking on a link brings it up in a new tab in the existing window rather than a new window.
Yes, there may well be, I'll ask around, thank you.
begin Tim's quote in uk.finance about: Re: Good online banking
A newsreader which incorrectly parses ordinary body text as an attachment, by not correctly checking for attachment markers, can justifiably be said to be broken. There is a defined standard for attachments, which all other newsreaders follow correctly. By its very nature, ordinary text has (almost) free scope as to its contents. The agreed marker for attachments - in its entirety - was defined so as to be something which would never occur in body text.
A newsreader which allows infective attachments to be run automatically, in many cases installing rogue mail relays to flood innocent parties' mailboxes with further viruspams, can also be said to be broken.
(etc, etc, etc)
[These are but a couple of bugs, what other sloppy coding lies underneath?]
Don't know, don't care, and they're hardly libellious claims.
Everything else I want to say about this matter is at the above URL, so I don't wish to irritate the newsgroup by continuing this discussion further.
If you are concerned about your security, I _would_ strongly advise you to use a less-insecure newsreader (or to lobby the developers to fix the one that you do use).
This is sincere advice, and _is_ meant in your best interests.
Not needed - I read your previous posts readily, using Outlook Express. [I didn't use "Ctrl-F3" either!!]
"David Marsh" wrote
I don't agree.
"David Marsh" wrote
A standard is only a "standard" if *all* relevant users agree it. Microsoft, it appears to me, is (certainly one of) the biggest player(s) and so an agreement between the tiddlers cannot be considered to be a true "standard". In fact, the way that the biggest player does things can usefully be considered a "standard"...
"David Marsh" wrote
I'd say that it is an incredibly useful feature. One that saves an awful amount of time & is helpful to many businesses (& other users!).
"David Marsh" wrote
You haven't quoted any bugs yet. Nothing you have pointed out wasn't designed-into the products (AIUI - but then I am not part of Microsoft!).
"David Marsh" wrote
Your comments on your website appear to allude to the position that it is
*Outlook* itself that is disseminating virii across the internet. This is a little like saying that "the wires connecting everybody together are infecting us with virii" - obviously correct (that's how they get to us) but it is not a problem with the wires!!
You also often speak of "bugs" in Outlook, where many would believe that they are simply (extremely) useful design features - not bugs at all.
You write as though you have a monopoly on being "correct" - you do not!
"David Marsh" wrote
The details there appeared to me to be very "sensationalist", and didn't provide any real information at all.
Oh, BTW - while surfing your website, I received a "Runtime Error" - now, whose software is "buggy"?? ["A Runtime Error has occurred. Do you wish to debug? Line: 19 Error: Object doesn't support this action"]
"David Marsh" wrote
I am perfectly happy with the security of my system as it is. Full firewall (both hardware & software) and regularly-updated antivirus systems have been enough to ensure that I have never been infected, in all the many years of use!
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