Chip and Pin - no more signatures

X-No-Archive: yes In message , Adrian Boliston writes

Spectacles for the long-sighted are very cheap now. Chichester market traders flog specs up strength 400 for 99p. Made in China. Decent quality metal frames, too. The neck cord cost more than the bloody specs! My specs are the last thing I put on in the morning. I have to take them on and off several times during the day, but that's my problem and I've learned to live with it. I've never had problems spending money.

They might not be able to ask 'what disability' but can they not ask for a letter from a doctor certifying that you have a good reason for wanting a chip+sig card (other than 'i can't be arsed to remember a simple 4 digit number'). Hopefully most doctors will charge for such a letter and this will put a stop to such NIMBYish atitudes.

the chips are the same, its just the configuration that is different.

... this is getting circular. I *do* need to be able to see the PIN pad clearly enough to be able to enter the PIN. While I generally can puzzle it out it's *far* easier to sign a slip as it's out in the open, it's white and all I have to be able to see is a space to sign in, no requirement to be actually able to read it.

If PIN pads were white and well lit I wouldn't have a problem but in practice they are mostly dark grey or black with not very legible numbers and, because of the bits trying to prevent others seeing you key the PIN, are badly lit.

I don't have a problem with ATM keypads (or phones, except mobiles) as I said but PIN keypads are just the absolute pits.

If you're riding a motorbike (which is what I'm doing nearly always when I pay by credit card) there's no way you're going to have glasses accessible.

At 08:54:29 on 13/10/2005, snipped-for-privacy@isbd.co.uk delighted uk.finance by announcing:

And *proper* PINpads are designed such that you can. It would seem to me that you've been exposed solely to crap ones.

At 08:55:59 on 13/10/2005, snipped-for-privacy@isbd.co.uk delighted uk.finance by announcing:

Why?

I've only seen the crap ones, too, I generally have to move my head and body a lot to see the display, they have very poor viewing angles.

As these crap ones are the ones installed in all the countries main shops, the OP seems to have a perfectly good argument.

Jim.

john boyle wrote: ...

I didn't say otherwise. The point I'm making is the banks' attitude, and if they took this view in the "insecure" pre-chip&pin days, they'll hardly relax now their system is "secure".

Anyway, I checked for a transcript, and came up with this (woman's name removed):

'Last year before the introduction of chip and pin, m*** s*** had her bag stolen in a restaurant and money fraudently withdrawn from her account. A week later she received a letter from her bank accusing her of acting carelessly with her pin. They said they would not refund her money. "I can't describe how I felt actually it's shock really I think. Because they said that I obviously hadn't taken due care with my pin number and therefore were not going to give me my money back. That was not the case. I didn't have my pin number written anywhere on my bag and I just couldn't believe this was happening."'

I suppose one could take the view she's a brazen liar. It seems more likely that the bank had a rose-tinted view of their own security.

Given the increased use of PINs, the chance of accidental disclosure is much higher, and with no fault to the customer. But who will the banks blame?

Peter King wrote: ...

No.

You got it the wrong way round. The C&P website says that you will not be asked for medical evidence, but it does not say that the card issuer cannot ask what disability you have.

My Amex card issued about 6 month ago is still magstripe.

Well, OK, since my use of PIN pads is hampered by my (not very) poor eyesight I will ask for a Chip&Sig card on that basis, seems reasonable to me.

'cos there's nowhere safe/sensible to put them.

That's one of the reasons that it's now free for motorcycles to cross the Thames at Dartford. Big delays were being caused by motorcyclists having to delve into their clothing to extract a few coins. Safe and good motorcycle clothing doesn't lend itself to carrying easily accessible small items.

In message , Mike Scott writes

What was the outcome?

Got my Amex card at the end of August so looks like they hadn't quite sorted it out by then. I spoke to their call centre (to activate the card) and they told me that they were beginning to roll out chip and pin shortly.

Don't really mind either way though as before I got my Amex card I'd just use C&P Maestro anyway.

John

They didn't say, unless they revisited this later in the documentary (iirc they didn't). The *implication* as I took it was that the bank won.